Mephisto Genetics The elephant in the supersoil room

[Scribble420]

Hey Guys,

I’d like to fire up (pun intended) a discussion regarding the Mephisto/gbd supersoil mix and any other amended organic type dealios... I’ve used kind soil which is a very similar concept. Had the same issues everyone else here is.

I’ve seen several journals using it with the same issue across the board. Running out of juice mid flower.

Please correct me if I’m wrong, I don’t have the time to dig too far back. I’ve had discussions with several forum members and I’d like to try to consolidate some of the information and experiences people are having in order to correct the issues before we run into them.

Looks like everyone is running out around 40-50 days into their grow. I propose to reamend the soil through top dressing. I’m thinking around day 30-35 assuming the plant is well established. Reapply top dressing every week or 2. Not really sure on quantities or intervals. Hoping some of you can provide feedback.

I’m also not sure what to amend. I’m thinking more supersoil mix that consists of the bottom half of the pot according to the grow guide directions (which I use the optional worm castings), insect frass, high phosphorus guano, and alfalfa meal. I also plan on using recharge (kelp, molasses, humics, fulvics, fungi, bacteria) and mammoth p (bacteria that increases phosphorus uptake). I will be using reverse osmosis water so I may have to supplement with cal mag, I want to look into oyster shell flour or something similar in the future.

So I’m looking for some input here. Bigger pots? More supersoil concentration? Different layering?

Maybe making our own soil is best?

I love the concept of a water only soil. Cannabis may be too demanding to have such convenience. I’m sure if we went overkill and grew autos in 10 gallon pots, the plants would thrive, or would they?

Ramble on...

 

[Tiny Bubbles]

I’m just pulling up a chair to listen as folks start to wander in to drop knowledge...

 

[slowandeasy]

Medium and pot size are very important. A small pot will run out of steam for sure. I don't think anything over 5 gal is needed with a good organic soil. Coco and Super Soil are not a great combo. I won't waste my seeds trying it until we find a good way to get to harvest. I did a couple plants. As you stated, they don't have enough steam to make it til the end... for my environment, lights, and Coco for sure.

If people figure out a good way, I will try it again. I have more. The end product is tasty as hell! Yield suffers, but excellent quality. I don't like huge pots, but water only is nice and so is organic. I won't do soil. So let's get a good Coco Super Soil plan together too! Peace, slow

 

[Rogue Chief]

Feed the plants a tea once a week, I can't comment on using the super soil mix for that because I am not sure of what is in it or the amounts used. Make an alfalfa/kelp tea (1 Tablespoon of each per gallon) and let steep for 24 hours, stir whenever you walk by it or not. I also make a neem/kelp tea (2 Tablespoons neem and 1 Tablespoon kelp per gallon) once I am 2-3 weeks into flower and cut the alfalfa.

Top dress your plants with more worm castings or a high quality compost and aim to keep the microbiology of the soil operating at full peak. If you have access to composting worms I would throw a few in each pot and keep the soil moist so the worms will stay home. These worms act as a living soil amendment and make everything more available to the plants. Using a mulch of plants you may have around your house such as yarrow, dandelion, comfrey, borage, or straw will help keep the top of the soil moist and will slowly break down and will eventually be turned into humus (compost) by the worms and other living creatures.

I find that running teas once a week help keep everything running along, especially in 5 to 7 gallon pots. If growing photoperiods in larger pots, you could more easily get away with top dressing a couple times through a cycle because the soil biology is easier to maintain in larger amounts.

I use a "living" soil that I made which I recycle every year after the outdoor season, the only time I grow and it is full of worms and seems to be nutrient and microbial rich. Let me know if you want or care to hear more about it.

 

[Arsenal]

My very first grow I used Kind Soil, 1/2 of the 5 lb bag in a 3 gallon pot and topped it off with Roots Organics Original, I didn't have the issues I've heard about on here but I guess it was beginners luck! Fast forward to my current grow I'm running Bush Doctors Coco Loco Ammended with the Biotabs products and things are looking good so far. I have become a true believer with checking and maintaining your pH, I actually learned this from maintaining my saltwater pool! I am going full steam with organic tea now also, KIS has some good products that I am starting to use. Difference is I now have more to do, my first grow I didn't feel like I did anything and the plants (genetics) and soil did all the work.

 

[Rogue Chief]

Good compost works really well for buffering soil PH, I never pay attention to the PH of anything but I also use Canadian sphagnum peat moss instead of coco coir and I don't use any bottled nutrients.

 

[Scribble420]

Medium and pot size are very important. A small pot will run out of steam for sure. I don't think anything over 5 gal is needed with a good organic soil. Coco and Super Soil are not a great combo. I won't waste my seeds trying it until we find a good way to get to harvest. I did a couple plants. As you stated, they don't have enough steam to make it til the end... for my environment, lights, and Coco for sure.

If people figure out a good way, I will try it again. I have more. The end product is tasty as hell! Yield suffers, but excellent quality. I don't like huge pots, but water only is nice and so is organic. I won't do soil. So let's get a good Coco Super Soil plan together too! Peace, slow

I don’t see why coco can’t be used as a filler. Roots organic is a coco blend. I’ve used coco loco with kind soil and had ok results. Still needed more food though.

Feed the plants a tea once a week, I can't comment on using the super soil mix for that because I am not sure of what is in it or the amounts used. Make an alfalfa/kelp tea (1 Tablespoon of each per gallon) and let steep for 24 hours, stir whenever you walk by it or not. I also make a neem/kelp tea (2 Tablespoons neem and 1 Tablespoon kelp per gallon) once I am 2-3 weeks into flower and cut the alfalfa.

Top dress your plants with more worm castings or a high quality compost and aim to keep the microbiology of the soil operating at full peak. If you have access to composting worms I would throw a few in each pot and keep the soil moist so the worms will stay home. These worms act as a living soil amendment and make everything more available to the plants. Using a mulch of plants you may have around your house such as yarrow, dandelion, comfrey, borage, or straw will help keep the top of the soil moist and will slowly break down and will eventually be turned into humus (compost) by the worms and other living creatures.

I find that running teas once a week help keep everything running along, especially in 5 to 7 gallon pots. If growing photoperiods in larger pots, you could more easily get away with top dressing a couple times through a cycle because the soil biology is easier to maintain in larger amounts.

I use a "living" soil that I made which I recycle every year after the outdoor season, the only time I grow and it is full of worms and seems to be nutrient and microbial rich. Let me know if you want or care to hear more about it.

Great info rogue. I’m trying to bridge the gap between hardcore organic and convenience. I use recharge to substitute for teas. I’m trying to make the system water only for the most part. Foliars, teas, etc are great, don’t get me wrong. But, some of us don’t have the time, space, etc to do all of that. I like the idea of fresh mulch breaking down and cycling into the media. Cover crop of clovers works well I hear too.

My very first grow I used Kind Soil, 1/2 of the 5 lb bag in a 3 gallon pot and topped it off with Roots Organics Original, I didn't have the issues I've heard about on here but I guess it was beginners luck! Fast forward to my current grow I'm running Bush Doctors Coco Loco Ammended with the Biotabs products and things are looking good so far. I have become a true believer with checking and maintaining your pH, I actually learned this from maintaining my saltwater pool! I am going full steam with organic tea now also, KIS has some good products that I am starting to use. Difference is I now have more to do, my first grow I didn't feel like I did anything and the plants (genetics) and soil did all the work.

That’s great that you got a good kind soil run. Most of us didn’t. Maybe yours was better than ours. I always questioned the consistency of the product. KIS does indeed have some great products. Tad is a smart guy and his podcast is full of organic goodness. I encourage everyone to check it out. The cannabis cultivation and science podcast. I know water only can be done by cooking your own soil with a coots type recipe, but once again, trying to make it convenient. I’m wondering if the two are polar opposites... you get what you put in, right?

 

[STILLSMOKIN]

I run 60% happy frog 30% perlite 10% coco in a five gallon bucket. Never had an issue with running out of anything. I did feed 1/2 strength nutes at times like bud candy and big bud. But i don't think it done any good. I reused the soil and mid grow i was starting to see some issues with mg deficient but turned out ph was low. Here she is now. I'm slowly bringing ph from 5 up to 6.5. She got hit with 7 yesterday and runoff was 6 again.

 

[Twiddles2]

Isn't Wonder Soil organic? It's coco coir and is supposed to feed for up to 4 months. I never tried it but it may be an option. Might even work in autopots?

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[Scribble420]

I run 60% happy frog 30% perlite 10% coco in a five gallon bucket. Never had an issue with running out of anything. I did feed 1/2 strength nutes at times like bud candy and big bud. But i don't think it done any good. I reused the soil and mid grow i was starting to see some issues with mg deficient but turned out ph was low. Here she is now. I'm slowly bringing ph from 5 up to 6.5. She got hit with 7 yesterday and runoff was 6 again. View attachment 902205

There has to be some form of nutrient cycling occurring. Sounds like your microbes are happy and healthy, breaking down the matter in the soil. It won’t last forever though, law of return reigns supreme.

This just goes to show, everyone seems to have a different way, a different answer for my questions. I realize there’s more than one way to skin the proverbial cat but I’m looking for the standards... the one thing everyone has in common. The only thing I’m seeing so far is a nice fluffy media with plenty of aeration and some form of fuel for the plants. I suppose it’s all about what works for you and your environment.

I will returning to the foray of organic gardening again with more knowledge and an eagerness to observe and learn.

Hoping to give another gardener out there some knowledge and inspiration to do the same.

Thanks everyone, keep the information and experience flowing!