New Grower Will a foliar feed help with low ph?

[Sauce]

So right now my issue is I had what I think to be phosphorus toxicity. I did a slight flush because my ph was also acting weird as well. It's now around 5.5 soil, I added some lime to try and bring it back up. Been dealing with something I thought was a cal/mag issue for a while, but seems to be getting worse.

So atm, soil PH went down a bit more with the flush. I flushed 1 gallon I then added 5ml of florakleen to another gallon flushed it through. I then put one more gallon of RO 7.0 water through it. PPM got to around 160s (run off).

I am adding a bit of nutes back to the soil, about 2-3 cups of tiger bloom 2.4 ml per gallon, 5ml per gallon of cal/mag, and 15ml per gallon of big bloom.


I am about 1.5-2 weeks into flowering.


So with a PH level of 5.5, can I foliar feed? I understand soil ph is very low at this time, and can not take up the nutes correctly at all. So I am wondering if the plant will take in the nutes if I foliar feed as well?

And if I do foliar feed, do I do 1/4 the dose recommended as well?


Thanks.

 

[briman]

No, it wont. It sounds like your ph is too low. What medium are you using? most lockouts start with ph being off, and it doesn't take much!!! I would get a handle on your ph water in and out and adjust where needed.

Here is a great tool for growing in soil, its called an accurate 8 soil probe and if you grow in soil/soiless mediums, this is a must have tool!!! With a ph pen and an accurate 8, you will dial in you ladies to epic proportions!!!
http://www.amazon.com/ACCURATE-SOIL-AND-MOISTURE-METER/dp/B00401CEH2

- - - Updated - - -

No, it wont. It sounds like your ph is too low. What medium are you using? most lockouts start with ph being off, and it doesn't take much!!! I would get a handle on your ph water in and out and adjust where needed.

Here is a great tool for growing in soil, its called an accurate 8 soil probe and if you grow in soil/soiless mediums, this is a must have tool!!! With a ph pen and an accurate 8, you will dial in you ladies to epic proportions!!!
http://www.amazon.com/ACCURATE-SOIL-AND-MOISTURE-METER/dp/B00401CEH2

 

[Trapper]

Foliar feeding doesn't effect ph, it only bypasses it....getting the items into the plant that would otherwise be locked out by the soil ph issues.

With all the things you flushed through the soil, the only one to stick around and do anything would be the last thing you did, everything else, for the most part, was washed away.

From what I've been told, RO won't "hold" a particular Ph very well because it's the minerals that allow it to stabilize.

The Fox Farms nutes lower (acidify) a solution's Ph but not a ton in small concentrations and the Cal/Mag will improve the RO's ability to "hold" a Ph but not entirely.
If you aren't Ph buffering your feed solutions, you might want to.

I personally would just water with 7.0 RO with some Cal/Mag a couple times (no nutes) and see what happens to your soil Ph...see if it starts working it's way up a bit.

I would also continue to foliar feed it Cal/Mag to stave off any deficiencies you can...I don't believe, however, that any of the other Trio line-up is appropriate for foliar
may need to pick up some Flowers Kiss Foliar feed. Not sure about that....

 

[Sauce]

I am using ffof. PH was decent a week or so ago, was at about 6.3. I have added lime to the soil. Sad part is, I added lime before i started this grow. PH started to drop, I added more lime to the soil, and yet again having a ph issue. Good times. So I have yet again added more lime to the soil. After this grow is done, I am not using ffof products again. User error or not, the soil is acting up way to much, had an issue with happy frog as well.

Water going in I did at 7.0 because the soil ph was so low, run off came out around 5.7. After flush probes telling me more or less 5.5 in the soil now.

I did a spray any ways, but now i see that isnt going to help heh. Guess I need to think of something since they guys are in flowering atm.

Thanks though.

 

[az2000]

So with a PH level of 5.5, can I foliar feed? I understand soil ph is very low at this time, and can not take up the nutes correctly at all. So I am wondering if the plant will take in the nutes if I foliar feed as well?

And if I do foliar feed, do I do 1/4 the dose recommended as well?

You can foliar feed even when your soil ph is perfect. You'd just want to be careful about the plant taking too much nutrients via soil and foliage. If the soil ph were perfect, and felt like foliar feeding, you'd probably do something like a seaweed/kelp supplement foliar so you're not adding to the NPK. I've read people doing this. (I'm planning on foliar feeding dissolved egg shell and epsom salt early into flower to see if I can avoid the predicted deficiency. I'll probably do a little AK kelp too).

If your plants are not showing signs of a deficiency, and you simply want to feed them NPK while you fix the soil ph, 1/4 of what you normally feed should be safe. If you caught the soil ph problem due to a deficiency, you might go a little higher strength. Ph it to 6.5.

The best thing to do would be to call the nutrient maker and ask them what they recommend for dilution.

Get some wetting agent (surfacant) so the water spreads and clings to the leaf. Look for a "360-precipitator" spray bottle which makes it easy to spray under the leaves.

 

[Waira]

:smoke: hey Sauce! ..nobody caught you at the LHT? Sorry mate, we are so undermanned right now, it'sjust plain getting tough to cover all our bases currently,... So, a big Yes! to foliar feeding when soil issues are vexing you! I'm in the same boat with the OF soil,... definitely on the acidic side, nad yes, dolomite lime is fairly slow acting, unless you can find a powdered form, which works more quickly,... I did look for hydrated lime (purely Ca, I think, no Mg in it, which is fine for pH purposes), and had no luck at the usual places,... I hear, it's a little dicey to work with because of it rapid reactions,... (stay clear of quicklime, waaay to gnarly),... what I did find at OSH was this interesting product called Encap Fast Acting Lime; it's a nano-tech thing I believe, with part of the granules formulated to react fast, and part of it more slowly, so you supposedly get a good balance of both,... we'll see! ** I forget, did we talk about using RO water, even pH'ed vs. harder tap water with more hardness/alkalinity in it to help buffer? Indeed, at 5.5, Ca and Mg start to really lose availability,...P is really hit at this pH too,... Looking at the pics, I'm a bit stumped at the symptoms,... afflicted leaves don't have the yellowing overall typical of Mg defc., nor the spotting of Ca,... no dark patches of dead tissue typical of P defc.,...maybe there is a toxicity issue here, but I'd rather a more experienced eye look at this first,... meantime foliar is the ticket! Do you have a water spreader/wetting agent? LOL- surely, we talked this already, didn't we? If not let me know,... some tips: spray top and bottom of leaves, but be very precise with it, and try not to overspray the buds any more than you have to... it's a pain at this stage, i know,... a clear water spray after the initial treatment dries helps more get absorbed too,...and clear away residues,... yeah 1/4 or so strength will be fine,.. holler back at the LHT if you can, okay? :Sharing One:

 

[Sauce]

Foliar feeding doesn't effect ph, it only bypasses it....getting the items into the plant that would otherwise be locked out by the soil ph issues.

With all the things you flushed through the soil, the only one to stick around and do anything would be the last thing you did, everything else, for the most part, was washed away.

From what I've been told, RO won't "hold" a particular Ph very well because it's the minerals that allow it to stabilize.

The Fox Farms nutes lower (acidify) a solution's Ph but not a ton in small concentrations and the Cal/Mag will improve the RO's ability to "hold" a Ph but not entirely.
If you aren't Ph buffering your feed solutions, you might want to.

I personally would just water with 7.0 RO with some Cal/Mag a couple times (no nutes) and see what happens to your soil Ph...see if it starts working it's way up a bit.

I would also continue to foliar feed it Cal/Mag to stave off any deficiencies you can...I don't believe, however, that any of the other Trio line-up is appropriate for foliar
may need to pick up some Flowers Kiss Foliar feed. Not sure about that....

You can foil feed with ff, went with 1/4 the dose. Have a fan blowing on them drying them out a bit before I stick them back in. I will try that though with the no nutes and see what happens. I normally have to water every 2 days. Thanks.

You can foliar feed even when your soil ph is perfect. You'd just want to be careful about the plant taking too much nutrients via soil and foliage. If the soil ph were perfect, and felt like foliar feeding, you'd probably do something like a seaweed/kelp supplement foliar so you're not adding to the NPK. I've read people doing this. (I'm planning on foliar feeding dissolved egg shell and epsom salt early into flower to see if I can avoid the predicted deficiency. I'll probably do a little AK kelp too).

If your plants are not showing signs of a deficiency, and you simply want to feed them NPK while you fix the soil ph, 1/4 of what you normally feed should be safe. If you caught the soil ph problem due to a deficiency, you might go a little higher strength. Ph it to 6.5.

The best thing to do would be to call the nutrient maker and ask them what they recommend for dilution.

Get some wetting agent (surfacant) so the water spreads and clings to the leaf. Look for a "360-precipitator" spray bottle which makes it easy to spray under the leaves.

I figured you woud chime in on this thread I read a lot about how you like to foliar feed ^^. There is def a deficiency going on. I can't pinpoint it, I still think its phosphorus toxicity. Acts like a cal/mag issue, but that shouldn't be the case at all since I been doing cal/mag and seen no improvements. Only getting worse. I will take some pictures when I find my camera. But big brown spots with yellowing. Leaves becoming brittle around the sides. I even cut off the bad leaves, and more showed up. So it's between that and PH issue atm. But I had this issue when PH was good so donno.

Thanks

hey Sauce! ..nobody caught you at the LHT? Sorry mate, we are so undermanned right now, it'sjust plain getting tough to cover all our bases currently,... So, a big Yes! to foliar feeding when soil issues are vexing you! I'm in the same boat with the OF soil,... definitely on the acidic side, nad yes, dolomite lime is fairly slow acting, unless you can find a powdered form, which works more quickly,... I did look for hydrated lime (purely Ca, I think, no Mg in it, which is fine for pH purposes), and had no luck at the usual places,... I hear, it's a little dicey to work with because of it rapid reactions,... (stay clear of quicklime, waaay to gnarly),... what I did find at OSH was this interesting product called Encap Fast Acting Lime; it's a nano-tech thing I believe, with part of the granules formulated to react fast, and part of it more slowly, so you supposedly get a good balance of both,... we'll see! ** I forget, did we talk about using RO water, even pH'ed vs. harder tap water with more hardness/alkalinity in it to help buffer? Indeed, at 5.5, Ca and Mg start to really lose availability,...P is really hit at this pH too,... Looking at the pics, I'm a bit stumped at the symptoms,... afflicted leaves don't have the yellowing overall typical of Mg defc., nor the spotting of Ca,... no dark patches of dead tissue typical of P defc.,...maybe there is a toxicity issue here, but I'd rather a more experienced eye look at this first,... meantime foliar is the ticket! Do you have a water spreader/wetting agent? LOL- surely, we talked this already, didn't we? If not let me know,... some tips: spray top and bottom of leaves, but be very precise with it, and try not to overspray the buds any more than you have to... it's a pain at this stage, i know,... a clear water spray after the initial treatment dries helps more get absorbed too,...and clear away residues,... yeah 1/4 or so strength will be fine,.. holler back at the LHT if you can, okay?

Nah been a few days, I took that time to try and do some research and see if I could figure it out. Seems what ever I do in life, I get hammered with a ton of issues. But thats how you learn, growing is no different
I have some pretty good lime, think I will stick to plain water with cal/mag and foiler feeds and see if this helps them. I know some say "DONT DO IT DURING FLOWER@!@@" But I do have the room temps and RH under control. So it's either do this or I feel I can really lose the flower all together heh.

As for a sprayer, I have this http://i.walmartimages.com/i/mp/00/85/39/04/00/0085390400407_P321146_500X500.jpg I spun the plants around while I sprayed. Then moved my hand from the bottem to the top as I sprayed as well to get under the leaves as well.


Found camera while typing this. Heres some pictures of what I am dealing with. First some information.

They are under LED for the flowering. 440 Solar Storm, It's 24 inches away. Nutes Tri. Been doing 1/4 tiger bloom, 1/2-3/4 big bloom, and 5-10 ml cal/mag. Again, I hate Products at this time lol, could be user error but no soil should be like this imo.

 

[Trapper]

You can foil feed with ff, went with 1/4 the dose. Have a fan blowing on them drying them out a bit before I stick them back in. I will try that though with the no nutes and see what happens. I normally have to water every 2 days. Thanks.

Cool, wasn't sure since they are synth....

 

[az2000]

I can't pinpoint it, I still think its phosphorus toxicity.

It looks like potassium deficiency to me. I've never had it, but I've seen a lot of pictures. IMO, this looks like yours. (<<link)

When I had my problem with acidic soil it looked like a lot of things. Mg def, sulpher def, nitrogen def. I really felt like foliar feeding Pennington Alaska Kelp helped a lot. It's cheap stuff from Home Depot. I had some sitting around and thought I'd try it. I used 1 tsp in a 16oz sprayer at first, then 1/2 tsp later.

 

[n00b]

I was under the impression you shouldn't foliar feed during flower as you are spraying your buds directly with nutes...any thoughts?

(Understood you are doing so to save your plant, I'm just asking in general)