Fungus gnats; how toxic is microbe lift?

[Royalroacho]

I've been battling fungus gnats since I set my new tent up. They love it in there. First I tried azamax, didn't work. I've tried sns 203 and 209, still using it. They seem to become resistant to it, they were almost completely gone after 2 weeks of treatment, then came back hard. I have 4 spiders in there and traps that catch about 500 a day. Not a big dent in their legion of thousands. I've been using peroxide as well, doesn't seem to be working. I ordered 50 million SF nematodes, but have read they're only effective at the beginning of an infestation. So looking ahead, I'm thinking of using the bmc products, but like 75% of the label is warnings about inhalation. I have a parrot, they're incredibly sensitive to air pollution, I'm assuming it's a bad idea. Ugh they're ruining everything. If anyone can give me some info about the bmc stuff or gnat control in general, I'd appreciate it very much. I really hope the nematodes work.

 

[Rev. Green Genes]

@Royalroacho there are several things to try other than what you already did. A drench made with spinosad or mosquito dunks will kill the ones under the soil, as should azamax. After a drench let the soil go dry for a bit longer than normal too.Put some diatomaceous earth over the top of the soil, and then cover it with an inch of sand to prevent them from burrowing up if they live. Put out yellow sticky traps to catch the adults that are left. I would also treat any houseplants around too. I have not tried it but, peppermint+rosemary+eucalyptus oils in a spray may also help.

If they persist after all of that and your still catching them on the sticky traps than you have to either get rid of the soil or get some serious pesticides. I am not supposed to name those around here.

I have had good luck with nematodes, but I have never tried them in pots. I would caution that they are swimmers, and if you water to pour through, you will lose the nematodes. It's not quite accurate to say they are only working at the beginning of infestation, it would be better to say that they are only working during the larval stage. Which is ongoing, they breed fast. They also will persist in the soil for quite a while as long as they are not washed out, so they act as a preventative because they get hungry and hungrier.

Where did the soil come from? is it bag soil or home mixed soil?

 

[Royalroacho]

I did try the azamax, I drenched them for 2 weeks, it didn't work. I also have tried the spinosad. I took some of the water from my dwc with some larvae in it. I poured it into a gallon of tap water and watched them resist azamax, peroxide and spiosad at recommended doses. I even just soaked them in spinosad and it didn't kill them. I've soaked several insects in spinosad, it only worked on thrips. Maybe it was the bottle, it was captain Jack's deadbug. I have a small aquarium with a bunch of cycled sponge filters I culture nitrobacter in for when I set up aquariums to raise baby fish. I saw the adults emerging from the water, climbing up the tank wall. Apparently they're capable of absorbing oxygen under water? What were they even eating in there? I sealed it up. They are in my bathroom drain too. I've poured 92% isopropylalcohol, azamax, draino, muriatic acid, peroxide, scrubbing bubbles and toilet bowl cleaner (not at the same time) in there, and watch them crawl out an hour later. They're really hard to kill. I have sticky traps, vinegar traps, and a ton of spiders, they catch alot but most of the adults seem to stay under the pots. I thought mosquito dunks were the same thing as the microbe lift product. Looking it up, it's a different bacteria, and doesn't look like a powder. The guy at the hydro shop misinformed me, again. I was buying them, he Said they made his dog sick from inhaling the powder that was dispersed into the air when he used them, I put them back. I also didn't know the nematodes would drain out so easily. I'm using coco and run off alot of water. Damn. They were expensive. I'm going to try the mosquito dunks.
They initially came from a bag of fox farms soil I got like 2 years ago. There were always a few around, but weren't causing noticeable problems or becoming an infestation until I set up this tent 2 months ago. It's super dry in here in the winter, I have to use a pond fogger in a bucket to get the rh up enough, it makes perfect conditions for them

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[namvet25]

Try using some diatomaceous earth and cover the potting soil with it.

 

[lunarman]

Mosquito dunks crushed up and watered in to the soil. Maybe a quarter dunk per plant.
Then sand on top to stop the adult/egg/larvae cycle. The fliers can't penetrate sand so they have no place to lay eggs.
Also make sure you don't have any bags of soil etc around the tent/room where they could be hatching too.

 

[Waira]

yes, breaking the generational cycle is key, and eliminating the original source of them if possible,...(tell me there's no bag or pot of open soil sitting around in there, or close by)... Adults are little more than flying gonads, they don't really feed,.. it's larvae that can munch roots,... the problem with drenches is getting enough concentration to hit them after going through the dilution that soil dispersion creates,.. also, I don't think spinosad is effective against them,... Both Azamax and spinosad are not instant contact killers, they need to be ingested, or the vermin hosed down with them well enough to get into their bodies, also something difficult to achieve in soil,... the best I know, the Bt strain that kills mosquito's also kills gnats, as they are closely related,.. Spinosad is not that broad in killing spectrum, Azamax is a bit better,...remember, Aza' is just a refined neem product,...same limitations, same stank and residues, which i why I never recommend it during bloom!... SNS209 worked great for me on external pests, but i have no idea how well it will work on soil bound larvae,.. it works by making the saps taste bad, and I know from experience that it won't deter some verimin from snacking anyway, or with aphids, landing on the plant and crapping out babies everywhere,... Bt needs to be ingested too, BTW,.. I like to make a activating solution, then water it in,... for 1gal clear water, add 1T molasses, a dash of nutes, and a generous amount of granules/ground puck, like 3T,.. aerate it if you can, keep it warm, and let stew covered with a paper towel or something breathable, for 24 hours or so,... this seems to get them activated sooner from what my experience has been,.. nothing works overnight either, so give it some time,...

 

[Royalroacho]

yes, breaking the generational cycle is key, and eliminating the original source of them if possible,...(tell me there's no bag or pot of open soil sitting around in there, or close by)... Adults are little more than flying gonads, they don't really feed,.. it's larvae that can munch roots,... the problem with drenches is getting enough concentration to hit them after going through the dilution that soil dispersion creates,.. also, I don't think spinosad is effective against them,... Both Azamax and spinosad are not instant contact killers, they need to be ingested, or the vermin hosed down with them well enough to get into their bodies, also something difficult to achieve in soil,... the best I know, the Bt strain that kills mosquito's also kills gnats, as they are closely related,.. Spinosad is not that broad in killing spectrum, Azamax is a bit better,...remember, Aza' is just a refined neem product,...same limitations, same stank and residues, which i why I never recommend it during bloom!... SNS209 worked great for me on external pests, but i have no idea how well it will work on soil bound larvae,.. it works by making the saps taste bad, and I know from experience that it won't deter some verimin from snacking anyway, or with aphids, landing on the plant and crapping out babies everywhere,... Bt needs to be ingested too, BTW,.. I like to make a activating solution, then water it in,... for 1gal clear water, add 1T molasses, a dash of nutes, and a generous amount of granules/ground puck, like 3T,.. aerate it if you can, keep it warm, and let stew covered with a paper towel or something breathable, for 24 hours or so,... this seems to get them activated sooner from what my experience has been,.. nothing works overnight either, so give it some time,...

I ended up getting the microbe lift and some pherem9ne traps greenjeans brought to my attention. The initial reason for the post concerning it's toxicity was because the hydroshop guy told me it was a powder that gets into the air, and said it made his dog violently ill from inhalation. It's a liquid dropper bottle. I really need to check everything they tell me. I don't understand how so many confused people end up working at hydroshops with little to no familiarity with the products they sell, but they always seem so confident in thier misinformation. I guess it is the guys who are really, really blazed all the time. Oh well, here I am making posts about toxic pet killing powder continuing the misinformation effect. Damn stoners lol. I don't have any soil or anything sitting around, the problem is my aquariums. I used to breed a ton of fish, and my property manager is aware of that, she questioned me about electricity usage. I had 15 tanks going, I was using more juice than I do growing. I can't run them all and my grow operation, I still have a couple tanks with fish, but I have most of them just sitting here with little hang on filters as decoys, I use one to raise fry now and then, and I put a few fish in them when she does her yearly inspection. I've noticed that they're in the filters, and the larvae fall out sometimes and swim around. I'm putting the bmc in there, hopefully it works. I know it takes awhile to kill them. I also have the nematodes coming. I'm using coco. What would be the best method of activating the cysts? I have some big plants in small pots, in mid bloom consuming alot, one of them takes 2.5 gallons a day, can I activate the cysts in regular nutrient solution?


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[Rev. Green Genes]

I ended up getting the microbe lift and some pherem9ne traps greenjeans brought to my attention. The initial reason for the post concerning it's toxicity was because the hydroshop guy told me it was a powder that gets into the air, and said it made his dog violently ill from inhalation. It's a liquid dropper bottle. I really need to check everything they tell me. I don't understand how so many confused people end up working at hydroshops with little to no familiarity with the products they sell, but they always seem so confident in thier misinformation. I guess it is the guys who are really, really blazed all the time. Oh well, here I am making posts about toxic pet killing powder continuing the misinformation effect. Damn stoners lol. I don't have any soil or anything sitting around, the problem is my aquariums. I used to breed a ton of fish, and my property manager is aware of that, she questioned me about electricity usage. I had 15 tanks going, I was using more juice than I do growing. I can't run them all and my grow operation, I still have a couple tanks with fish, but I have most of them just sitting here with little hang on filters as decoys, I use one to raise fry now and then, and I put a few fish in them when she does her yearly inspection. I've noticed that they're in the filters, and the larvae fall out sometimes and swim around. I'm putting the bmc in there, hopefully it works. I know it takes awhile to kill them. I also have the nematodes coming. I'm using coco. What would be the best method of activating the cysts? I have some big plants in small pots, in mid bloom consuming alot, one of them takes 2.5 gallons a day, can I activate the cysts in regular nutrient solution?


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For nematodes in pots I would try to space out the applications rather going in all at once. They may have a shorter life in pots big time. So mix them with plain pH'd water no nutes. Water just enough to let a little water out the bottom. Let them go for a day before you add more nutes. Do that once a week or so and it will help.

But you have a unique situation, you are going to have break down all that aquarium gear and do a proper cleaning. Thats probably the only way to break the cycle completely. And a lot cheaper than throwing money at it.

 

[Royalroacho]

For nematodes in pots I would try to space out the applications rather going in all at once. They may have a shorter life in pots big time. So mix them with plain pH'd water no nutes. Water just enough to let a little water out the bottom. Let them go for a day before you add more nutes. Do that once a week or so and it will help.

But you have a unique situation, you are going to have break down all that aquarium gear and do a proper cleaning. Thats probably the only way to break the cycle completely. And a lot cheaper than throwing money at it.

I called you greenjeans. Must have been thinking of captain kangaroo again. Im probably going to need to break everything down after this harvest and do a thorough spring cleaning. It'll coincide with my inspection anyway. I'm gonna get rid of the swampier plant tanks, and put live bearers in the decoy tanks, it'll help maintain the pretense that I'm still running all this power for fish . Theyre ravenous insectivores, don't need heaters, and also I like them. I should have thought of that before. I'll keep the nematodes for outdoors this summer, I don't think they're going to work in coco, sounds like they'll probably wash out. These pheromone traps are working very well, thanks for recommending that [emoji106]


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