Please help guys - before it gets out of control

[hype281]

Firstly, I'm a complete noob and this is my first grow. I'm working on 2 plants under a 400w led (185 @ wall) - both are autoflowers small one is moc white widow while the larger one is barneys nyc diesel.. Initially when I started the plants were stretching a little its been a grow under all led no other supplemental lighting but they seemed to be doing well -- so i moved them closer to the led about 16 inches away from it. recently the plants leaves started curling up -- initially it wasnt bad but past 2 days i noticed some newer leaves starting to curl the same (canoeing taco'ing etc) -- thinking its heat stress because im in india, so i moved the plants further away from lights now they are at about 30 inches and have a fan blowing at the top -- temps range from 79-82 degrees with humidty ranging from 56% to 63%.. nyc is ahead by 1 1/2 w but its showing problematic signs the initial problem hasnt worsened since 1 1/2 days (curling) but now I notice there are burns ONLY on the very tip of the leaves not all but some newer growth (see pics). Im growing in 100% coco -- watering schedule for week 1 was 60ml water from a mixture 2 ml Sensi Cal Mag Xtra and 2 ml FloraNova grow @ 5.8 ph corrected after nutes... gradually increasing the water and nute concentration over time while keeping ph between 5.7-6.0 range. Now I'm on day 20 and I've been watering 1l with 2 ml Sensi Cal Mag Xtra and 6 ml FloraNova grow and 150ml to small one. Generally I've read that you shouldnt worry about runoff in coco, but seeing as these problems are coming up I decided to check runoff -- Im using a HM-200 digital ph meter calibrated before taking reading -- as I said im feeding them at 5.7-6.0 range but runoff was clocking closer to 8.. scary.. I'll admit I havent been watering every day because the coco seems damp all the time -- should i do a flush, if so whats the best method? im thinking its bad quality coco since it was locally purchased -- i did a rinse a single time before planting the seedling though. Anyways I'll post pics now so you guys can hopefully help me diagnose this problem. I know my setup is ghetto, its the best I could do here..

 

[Ripper]

the taco on the leaf I can not figure out.. do you rotate your plants so the fan is not blowing in the same direction? The tip burn looks like it is just from the nutrients... back off of them a little and they should be fine... at least that is what I see... some pro will come in with better advice I am sure....

 

[hype281]

the taco on the leaf I can not figure out.. do you rotate your plants so the fan is not blowing in the same direction? The tip burn looks like it is just from the nutrients... back off of them a little and they should be fine... at least that is what I see... some pro will come in with better advice I am sure....

appreciate the response.. i've been rotating everyday when i clean the drainage tray but most of the curling occurred when plants were very close to the light so that may have been the issue with the taco leaves.. i'll keep it monitored though and ill make sure i rotate often as you suggested -- ok ill wait for some more advice if nothing ill back off nutrients a bit -- the reason i dont understand its nute burn is because im giving them floranova grow which is high n but the leaves arent really like dark green more of a pale green or do you think they look normal

 

[Ripper]

appreciate the response.. i've been rotating everyday when i clean the drainage tray but most of the curling occurred when plants were very close to the light so that may have been the issue with the taco leaves.. i'll keep it monitored though and ill make sure i rotate often as you suggested -- ok ill wait for some more advice if nothing ill back off nutrients a bit -- the reason i dont understand its nute burn is because im giving them floranova grow which is high n but the leaves arent really like dark green more of a pale green or do you think they look normal

the close lights will taco the leaves... just back off the nutes they should darken up.

 

[hype281]

ok will do... i was following growpotcheaply's feeding chart but i was skipping some days because people were saying coco looks too moist dont water etc.. so i backed off on everyday feeding up until a week 1/2 ago when i felt the plants were getting bigger so i should start feeding daily with 1l ph'd ro water and 75% strength nutes.. but i'll back off nutes and go back to 1/2 strength

 

[Waira]

Hype-- Yup, lights were way too close; general recommendations for LED's is about 18"-24", depending on wattage and plants age... I think your symptoms are all related to this as well; the intensity and heat puts transpiration stress on the leaves, and kinda cooks the chlorophyll...
..the pH of direct run-off isn't an accurate measure of the in-medium pH, though getting an reading of 8.0 is puzzling; this method of testing pH is lousy in general, full of measurement errors typically, but there is an improved procedure that helps eliminate some of this-- here's a link, follow directions and calculation carefully! ( https://www.autoflower.org/threads/...-testing-and-ph-estimation.41733/#post-928975 )
...Coco is a pretty specialized grow media; it is NOT soil, nor is it like peat based soilless mixed like Promix.. coco has unique properties, specifically concerning Cation Exchange Capacity, and so your nutrient regiment (there are several coco specialized nute's out there) and watering style need to be tailored to it... if you've not read up on such coco grow method info, best do so ASAP,... coco can hold lots of water, but it's advantage is that it breathes better than soil/peat, so it's less prone to suffocating the roots when well watered...you should include perlite though, to help facilitate this, and better faster drainage,... yes, bad coco can cause all kinds of trouble! it has a veru high native Na and K content, which needs to be rinsed and buffered out, something most companies do to varying degrees before packaging; I think you're okay, since by now, if there was a high K and especially Na content, there'd be signs... Coco specific nutes are formulated to deal with coco's odd CEC characteristics,.. good thing you're including extra Ca-Mg! As you'll see in researching, coco is particularly greedy for Ca, and to a lesser degree, Mg,...

 

[hype281]

Hype-- Yup, lights were way too close; general recommendations for LED's is about 18"-24", depending on wattage and plants age... I think your symptoms are all related to this as well; the intensity and heat puts transpiration stress on the leaves, and kinda cooks the chlorophyll...
..the pH of direct run-off isn't an accurate measure of the in-medium pH, though getting an reading of 8.0 is puzzling; this method of testing pH is lousy in general, full of measurement errors typically, but there is an improved procedure that helps eliminate some of this-- here's a link, follow directions and calculation carefully! ( https://www.autoflower.org/threads/...-testing-and-ph-estimation.41733/#post-928975 )
...Coco is a pretty specialized grow media; it is NOT soil, nor is it like peat based soilless mixed like Promix.. coco has unique properties, specifically concerning Cation Exchange Capacity, and so your nutrient regiment (there are several coco specialized nute's out there) and watering style need to be tailored to it... if you've not read up on such coco grow method info, best do so ASAP,... coco can hold lots of water, but it's advantage is that it breathes better than soil/peat, so it's less prone to suffocating the roots when well watered...you should include perlite though, to help facilitate this, and better faster drainage,... yes, bad coco can cause all kinds of trouble! it has a veru high native Na and K content, which needs to be rinsed and buffered out, something most companies do to varying degrees before packaging; I think you're okay, since by now, if there was a high K and especially Na content, there'd be signs... Coco specific nutes are formulated to deal with coco's odd CEC characteristics,.. good thing you're including extra Ca-Mg! As you'll see in researching, coco is particularly greedy for Ca, and to a lesser degree, Mg,...

Hi, first of all, appreciate the wealth of knowledge and advice . Secondly, do you think I should back up off the nutes also? You mentioned that the heat stress might have been the reason for the nute burn look on the tips so I was wondering what your stance was on backing off nutes. Also, some of the lower leaves maybe displaying a lighter green color (they are new growth ) ill have to check in the morning with pics before lights out.

 

[Joe383]

I run my 600 HPS about 16" away all the time. I am running it at about 20 now due to the light spread. The light being close could cause this though as I tried to run it at about 10" or so and it started to taco and bleach the tops of my plant. I think it is a high nutrient issue though. The leafs that are getting the most light usually end up the most damaged because they are were the most photosynthesis is happening. I have a friend that was running his led for his small plants, a 240 actual watt black dog about 10" just fine but it was in an open room with no walls close enough for reflection. They were also photo plants. I think you also have a slight mag deficiency. I would back off the nutrients a little and feed a little mag.

 

[Waira]

...no, stay on the nutes ... it'll take several days to regain color,... a little tip burn is a pretty generic symptom, usually nute' burn, but not always, and env. stressors can magnify what wouldn't otherwise be a problem,...

 

[Joe383]

...no, stay on the nutes ... it'll take several days to regain color,... a little tip burn is a pretty generic symptom, usually nute' burn, but not always, and env. stressors can magnify what wouldn't otherwise be a problem,...

Take every thing I say as an opinion. I am an organic grower and some times am wrong. If this was organic soil with bottled nutrients I would flush, wait a week and start feeding again. I have not grown in the coco yet.