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" Dutch Passion Tony's thoughts on Calcium uptake and LED's" or something similar.
One other important aspect of LED is the fact that the light comes evenly from a panel of 3 feet x 3 feet. Or 1m x 1m for us Europeans. The effect of that is a more even spread of light rather than a single point source as you have with a traditional HPS Bulb. LED is similar in concept to the ‘travelling light’, or HPS on a rail where the light rolls from one side of the room to the other ensuring that all plants get some direct light at some point. The problem with the travelling light technique is that for a lot of the time the bud is getting low light. The idea of spreading that illumination out,a s the LED panel does, results in all the plants is getting a fair share of light all the time And all the light the plant does get is rich in the most useful wavelengths. It is a dream scenario for the plant and perhaps that alters the plants feed requirements. It seems to increase the requirement for calcium and magnesium and I am sure that is key to understanding what it is that LED does differently.
Here is an initial theory on why magnesium deficiencies are seen. Magnesium is used in several ways, it is also needed as part of the chlorophyll molecule itself. Could it be that LED grown plants use extra Magnesium to produce extra chlorophyll to deal with the increased levels of useful light? I don’t know, but it is a fair question to ask.
Calcium is used in different ways by the plants but one way is in cell walls and membranes. It is used in enzymes and transporting of other nutrients. Somehow more of this is going on.
So my thoughts are along several different lines right now.
LED is now more effective ‘watt for watt’ than HPS. The poor public image of LED is down to some early exaggerated claims that never survived public scrutiny. But LED technology has really moved on in the last year or so.
I think the LED market will really takeoff when there is a bit more serious competition. HydrogrowLED look like they could give HPS a serious run for it’s money in coming years but prices will have to drop. I can’t believe that the LED manufacture can be so expensive, a few cents each but surely not too much when LED’s are being produced by the million in the Far East. And assembly of the components is something the Chinese can do with their eyes shut for a fraction of the price we can achieve in the west. So $1,000 or more for a 300 watt LED device seems excessive. Get the price down to $300-$400 and hardened HPS devotees will buy them. In my opinion LED prices are going to have to soften in order to get mass market appeal. At current prices I think 90% of customers will never be able to justify it even though they might love to have one.
But technically they are really moving LEDalong. It makes me wonder where LED light performance might be in a few years time. For those that worry about heat signatures and energy consumption then LED has obvious attractions. The light is all fully usable by the plant and it is delivered from an evenly lit panel rather than a single point. So all the plant surface area can join in the photosynthetic fun.
I have one other point to make about LED. By my reckoning some 40% of available surface area on the panel is not used. I am sure there is a reason for this such as limits in soldering density, or something even sillier reason such as the current factory only make circular units. But I am sure that these problems could be overcome. LED panels could be made brighter by filling some of the ‘dead space’ on the panel with more LED’s. And like I said, I really can’t believe the LED’s themselves can cost that much. We have seen LED’s move from 1 watt to 3 watts in the last couple of years. What happens when they find a way to mass produce a 5W or even a 7W version? And prices will drop like they do for everything else that is mass-producible. I remember being mesmerised by the first electronic calculator I saw, ‘could I ever afford one of my own?’ I wondered. And barely a decade later you were getting them for free when you filled up your car with gas.
I think we need to ask the nutrient manufacturers how they need to reformulate their products to allow for the new feeding requirements of the plants and I will check around the Dutch Passion office to see if we have any contacts and let you know. I am sure I can initiate some cooperation from my mineralised brothers in the nutrient world. I will see if I can get them to register onsite and give us their views.
I think LED will really take off. Right now it is still in the stage of the ‘early adopter’ . It will become a mainstream technology but manufacturers will first face up to a transition from ‘premium market’ to ‘mass market’ and change profit expectations for it to happen.
And Seymour, we would truly love to see you scrog a couple of AutoMazars, let me know if you are serious about that,perhaps after this grow. If you are serious,we will get you some seeds and run a ‘guess the yield’ contest. But I would go for both LED panels (or evenbetter 2x penetrator pro’s !) rather than one. Make it spectacular !
The plant continues to look excellent Seymour, how much is she drinking each day ? I wondered whether there was a hint of nutrient burn at the tips of the leaves on one shot? As you say, she might need another week before the PK14 boost. I am amazed she is at an EC of 1.6 when the Mazar would only take an EC of 1.0 under the same conditions.
You are doing great mate
This post was originally posted by "Dutchpassiontony" on the Autoflower network
Unfortunately this post was lost in forum upgrades.
I had posted it elsewhere on the net and I am reposting it here, so the knowledge isn't lost.
This is an historic post (2012 approx) and LED tech and nutrient feed have improved since then but an interesting article none the less.
One other important aspect of LED is the fact that the light comes evenly from a panel of 3 feet x 3 feet. Or 1m x 1m for us Europeans. The effect of that is a more even spread of light rather than a single point source as you have with a traditional HPS Bulb. LED is similar in concept to the ‘travelling light’, or HPS on a rail where the light rolls from one side of the room to the other ensuring that all plants get some direct light at some point. The problem with the travelling light technique is that for a lot of the time the bud is getting low light. The idea of spreading that illumination out,a s the LED panel does, results in all the plants is getting a fair share of light all the time And all the light the plant does get is rich in the most useful wavelengths. It is a dream scenario for the plant and perhaps that alters the plants feed requirements. It seems to increase the requirement for calcium and magnesium and I am sure that is key to understanding what it is that LED does differently.
Here is an initial theory on why magnesium deficiencies are seen. Magnesium is used in several ways, it is also needed as part of the chlorophyll molecule itself. Could it be that LED grown plants use extra Magnesium to produce extra chlorophyll to deal with the increased levels of useful light? I don’t know, but it is a fair question to ask.
Calcium is used in different ways by the plants but one way is in cell walls and membranes. It is used in enzymes and transporting of other nutrients. Somehow more of this is going on.
So my thoughts are along several different lines right now.
LED is now more effective ‘watt for watt’ than HPS. The poor public image of LED is down to some early exaggerated claims that never survived public scrutiny. But LED technology has really moved on in the last year or so.
I think the LED market will really takeoff when there is a bit more serious competition. HydrogrowLED look like they could give HPS a serious run for it’s money in coming years but prices will have to drop. I can’t believe that the LED manufacture can be so expensive, a few cents each but surely not too much when LED’s are being produced by the million in the Far East. And assembly of the components is something the Chinese can do with their eyes shut for a fraction of the price we can achieve in the west. So $1,000 or more for a 300 watt LED device seems excessive. Get the price down to $300-$400 and hardened HPS devotees will buy them. In my opinion LED prices are going to have to soften in order to get mass market appeal. At current prices I think 90% of customers will never be able to justify it even though they might love to have one.
But technically they are really moving LEDalong. It makes me wonder where LED light performance might be in a few years time. For those that worry about heat signatures and energy consumption then LED has obvious attractions. The light is all fully usable by the plant and it is delivered from an evenly lit panel rather than a single point. So all the plant surface area can join in the photosynthetic fun.
I have one other point to make about LED. By my reckoning some 40% of available surface area on the panel is not used. I am sure there is a reason for this such as limits in soldering density, or something even sillier reason such as the current factory only make circular units. But I am sure that these problems could be overcome. LED panels could be made brighter by filling some of the ‘dead space’ on the panel with more LED’s. And like I said, I really can’t believe the LED’s themselves can cost that much. We have seen LED’s move from 1 watt to 3 watts in the last couple of years. What happens when they find a way to mass produce a 5W or even a 7W version? And prices will drop like they do for everything else that is mass-producible. I remember being mesmerised by the first electronic calculator I saw, ‘could I ever afford one of my own?’ I wondered. And barely a decade later you were getting them for free when you filled up your car with gas.
I think we need to ask the nutrient manufacturers how they need to reformulate their products to allow for the new feeding requirements of the plants and I will check around the Dutch Passion office to see if we have any contacts and let you know. I am sure I can initiate some cooperation from my mineralised brothers in the nutrient world. I will see if I can get them to register onsite and give us their views.
I think LED will really take off. Right now it is still in the stage of the ‘early adopter’ . It will become a mainstream technology but manufacturers will first face up to a transition from ‘premium market’ to ‘mass market’ and change profit expectations for it to happen.
And Seymour, we would truly love to see you scrog a couple of AutoMazars, let me know if you are serious about that,perhaps after this grow. If you are serious,we will get you some seeds and run a ‘guess the yield’ contest. But I would go for both LED panels (or evenbetter 2x penetrator pro’s !) rather than one. Make it spectacular !
The plant continues to look excellent Seymour, how much is she drinking each day ? I wondered whether there was a hint of nutrient burn at the tips of the leaves on one shot? As you say, she might need another week before the PK14 boost. I am amazed she is at an EC of 1.6 when the Mazar would only take an EC of 1.0 under the same conditions.
You are doing great mate
This post was originally posted by "Dutchpassiontony" on the Autoflower network
Unfortunately this post was lost in forum upgrades.
I had posted it elsewhere on the net and I am reposting it here, so the knowledge isn't lost.
This is an historic post (2012 approx) and LED tech and nutrient feed have improved since then but an interesting article none the less.
