New Grower Question regarding AN PH Perfect

[Skurge]

So I'm going to begin feeding in a few days, and from what I've been reading AN nutrient solutions are NOT supposed to be PH adjusted? Using everything in Tang's Feeding Schedule, soiless medium (Pro Mix HP CC which tested 6.5 PH on the dot out of the bag). If I understand correctly, PH adjusting AN nutes will cause more harm than good?

And I assume everything from their lineup is designed to work with the PH perfect base nutes (carboload, sensizym, cal mag, bud factor x etc). On their site it states that rhino skin and bud factor x are designed to work with PH perfect, but can't find anything solid on the other additives working with PH perfect.

This probably seems like a stupid question, but I've read so many mixed opinions on this in the last few hours. There are people claiming that AN themselves stated adjusting the PH of PH Perfect stuff will do more harm than good, and others using sensi grow a+b that use ph up/down and are doing fine.

 

[BII]

You don't need pH adjustment, presuming you're source water is not too far off from what it needs to be for the pH Perfect technology to fully work (Is your water particularly high or low pH?), and obviously pH Perfect won't work as well (seems to be all or nothing) if you use lower base nutrient doses. Most likely your water will work - simply run some tests at small scale.

Regarding ability to mix AN supplements with the pH Perfect base nutes, they are all compatible. You are likely having problems "finding anything solid on this" because it is simply common knowledge - the stuff works rather well. You can see exemplary grows here where essentially every AN additive was mixed-in at some point.

My Eastern US river water has high pH. After adding supplements likely to affect pH and buffering, such as cal-mag and silicone/Rhino Skin supplements, I simply add pH Down and reduce the pH to in the general range where I want it to eventually be (5.8 for me using coco coir). Then I mix-in the rest of the nutes, with it always coming out "pH Perfect," even though I'm only feeding at slightly over 1/2-dose (2 ml/L). For me, it works perfectly with my mix ending up at about 5.8 within +/- .1. I presume you simply can't go wrong starting with water at pH you want it to end up at.

I don't know how it would work if you want a terminal pH of 6.5 or whatever pH is used with soil. But there are certainly soil growers using these nutes who hopefully will comment. If after mixing it doesn't come out at the pH you want it, I see no reason why you can't simply adjust it. [But wait and see what others more expert than I say].

 

[BII]

And you should Email or call AN "Grower Support" Go to http://www.advancednutrients.com/growersupport/. They can give you authoritative answers to your rather basic questions.

 

[Skurge]

You don't need pH adjustment, presuming you're source water is not too far off from what it needs to be for the pH Perfect technology to fully work (Is your water particularly high or low pH?), and obviously pH Perfect won't work as well (seems to be all or nothing) if you use lower base nutrient doses. Most likely your water will work - simply run some tests at small scale.

Regarding ability to mix AN supplements with the pH Perfect base nutes, they are all compatible. You are likely having problems "finding anything solid on this" because it is simply common knowledge - the stuff works rather well. You can see exemplary grows here where essentially every AN additive was mixed-in at some point.

My Eastern US river water has high pH. After adding supplements likely to affect pH and buffering, such as cal-mag and silicone/Rhino Skin supplements, I simply add pH Down and reduce the pH to in the general range where I want it to eventually be (5.8 for me using coco coir). Then I mix-in the rest of the nutes, with it always coming out "pH Perfect," even though I'm only feeding at slightly over 1/2-dose (2 ml/L). For me, it works perfectly with my mix ending up at about 5.8 within +/- .1. I presume you simply can't go wrong starting with water at pH you want it to end up at.

I don't know how it would work if you want a terminal pH of 6.5 or whatever pH is used with soil. But there are certainly soil growers using these nutes who hopefully will comment. If after mixing it doesn't come out at the pH you want it, I see no reason why you can't simply adjust it. [But wait and see what others more expert than I say].

Thanks for the reply, my tap water is right around 7.0 PH and 95-100 PPM. Straight out of the tap it's a bit higher, but after letting it sit out and bubbling it a bit, it always ends up in that range. I'm growing in a soiless media (Pro Mix HP CC), so my PH should be around 6.0-6.3. From what I understand, the PH is irrelevant because the nutes are designed to be absorbed in a wide PH rage (5-8) I believe. I'm just getting a bit confused, because I see many people using the AN line and still using PH Up/Down after mixing to reach their desired PH, but AN themselves say that PH adjusting PH perfect solutions can do more harm than good, but I've seen a few people claim this is BS, and that they just don't want anyone thinking that their product isn't working as intended. I also see a lot of others using these nutes and not PH adjusting at all. AN actually states that their rhino skin is designed to work with PH perfect and shouldn't effect it (believe it has a neutral PH, 5.7 or w/e). As for their sensi cal mag I see no such guarantee.

I would contact AN directly, but I don't see any situation where they would recommend PH adjusting their PH perfect nutes.

Think I'm just going to mix everything up and adjust the PH to 6.1-6.2 as I initially intended, unless I can find more solid info.

 

[BII]

Rather than adjusting pH after all the nutes are mixed, theoretically, it might be better (pH/buffering would be stabler; wouldn't be adding concentrated acid to react with a variety of nutrients) to start with stable pH-adjusted water. Perhaps, consider starting with water at your target 6.1-6.2, add the rest of your nutes and see what happens. In the worst case, you do fine tuning at the very end.

On the other hand, like AN would probably say, as long as you've got good water (as yours seems to be, compared to mine), you can just mix all the stuff up and the same nutes in solution will be just as bioavailable to the plants. They'd probably say that's what your paying for, the better chelation chemistries that allow this.

 

[A-Train]

I use AN ph perfect and pro mix. I feed @ 6.0 or 6.1 for soiless. When the sprouts first het food you won't be feeding enough if your using tap for the nutes to auto adjust. I use Botanicare ph down to get it where I want it. Once you begin feeding more later in the grow it will auto adjust but to 6.4 or 6.5 I still added ph down to get to 6.0. And yes all the other products will work with the ph perfect line up

 

[A-Train]

https://www.autoflower.org/index.php?threads/all-aboard-the-atrain-420-express.43029/

Here's my latest journal l. Read through some of the beginning there is a lot of discussion about pro mix and feeding then you can see the levels ph and stages of growth and choose the best route for yourself. But here is a first hand in depth read on your exact questions I think it may help

 

[Skurge]

I use AN ph perfect and pro mix. I feed @ 6.0 or 6.1 for soiless. When the sprouts first het food you won't be feeding enough if your using tap for the nutes to auto adjust. I use Botanicare ph down to get it where I want it. Once you begin feeding more later in the grow it will auto adjust but to 6.4 or 6.5 I still added ph down to get to 6.0. And yes all the other products will work with the ph perfect line up

Ok thanks that clears up my concerns, according to AN the PH perfect will work with RO water or water up to 100 PPM PH Range of 5-8 and at 1/4 strength or higher, so even on my first feed the PH perfect should work as intended (my tap water is just under 100 PPM with PH 7.0), but I'm still going to PH it to around 6.1. I assume it's just AN's policy to advice people to not use PH Adjustment with their PH perfect products, but a lot of people seem to do so without negative results.

 

[A-Train]

I used tap the entire time but I bubble 24 hrs prior to mix and feed

 

[Skurge]

I used tap the entire time but I bubble 24 hrs prior to mix and feed

I do the same exact thing with my tap water, do you just run an air pump or use air stones?

Just did my first feed today (day 9), was going to wait until tomorrow, but I'm pretty sure they can take it... Just concerned that I may have over watered a bit, it's an hour later and they're slightly drooping (just the tips not the whole leaf). After mixing 4ml of A+B and voodoo juice into 4L of water PH was 6.2 and PPM was 422, so I just left it as is. We'll see how the girls are looking tomorrow.

I'm having trouble judging when to water these smart pots, they felt very light today, if they were heavier than when I first filled them it definitely wasn't by much. But the soil 2-3" down was still damp.